Is Mitt Romney a Christian?
It is still amazing to hear.
For the first time since I moved to Utah (nineteen years ago), this state and the LDS faith is the topic of national conversation! CNN, FOX, Hannity, Rush-everybody is talking about things that we have dealt with daily for almost 2 decades! It's fascinating, but since the news media simply doesn't know that much about such things, here's some simple truths to help people who might be confused.
Are Mormons Christians?
Well, Mormons think they are. But the truth is , they are the only ones! Virtually every Christian denomination or church (i.e. Roman Catholic, Greek Orthodox, Protestant, etc.) deny Mormonism as a part of the Christian faith and have issued official statements as such. Sure some individuals may disagree (e.g. Jimmy Carter has said something to that effect), but that is pretty irrelevant. They just don't know much about the LDS faith (or their own, for that matter).
But Isn't the Name "Jesus Christ" in the Name of Their Church?
Yes it is, but really-so what? I can call myself Tom Selleck, but that doesn't make me him does it? China calls itself "The People's Republic of China". Does it belong to the people? Is it a Republic? Of course not-it's a communist dictatorship!
The name means nothing. (I just thought of a fast food place I know called "Quick and Tasty"-it is neither quick.... nor tasty.)
So Why Aren't Mormons Considered Christians?
Simple, really. Their foundational beliefs are too different from historic Christianity and the Bible to be considered Christian e.g. the nature of God and Jesus Christ, salvation, inspired revelation ,etc. (There are plenty of web sites to explain all this, so I will leave it to you to google them if you are interested! ) Virtually all non-Mormon scholars consider the Book of Mormon, Doctrines and Covenants, etc. to be utterly untrue. Joseph Smith, who said he translated golden plates into the Book of Mormon, is rejected as a prophet by every Christian church in the world.
So whatever the Mormon Church is, it just isn't accurate to call it Christian. This doesn't have anything to do with whether it's true or not ( I obviously don't believe it is, but that's not the point.)
And so, it looks like Mitt in in trouble already. The media is already pointing out his, well, truthstretching. As he tries to paint his faith as Christian, the Democrats aren't going to let him get away with it (just search his name on youtube for an interview on CNN, or MSNBC-one of those)
And so, it looks like my prophecy of a few months ago will not come true.
Apparantly, like Joseph Smith, I am not a prophet either!!
For the first time since I moved to Utah (nineteen years ago), this state and the LDS faith is the topic of national conversation! CNN, FOX, Hannity, Rush-everybody is talking about things that we have dealt with daily for almost 2 decades! It's fascinating, but since the news media simply doesn't know that much about such things, here's some simple truths to help people who might be confused.
Are Mormons Christians?
Well, Mormons think they are. But the truth is , they are the only ones! Virtually every Christian denomination or church (i.e. Roman Catholic, Greek Orthodox, Protestant, etc.) deny Mormonism as a part of the Christian faith and have issued official statements as such. Sure some individuals may disagree (e.g. Jimmy Carter has said something to that effect), but that is pretty irrelevant. They just don't know much about the LDS faith (or their own, for that matter).
But Isn't the Name "Jesus Christ" in the Name of Their Church?
Yes it is, but really-so what? I can call myself Tom Selleck, but that doesn't make me him does it? China calls itself "The People's Republic of China". Does it belong to the people? Is it a Republic? Of course not-it's a communist dictatorship!
The name means nothing. (I just thought of a fast food place I know called "Quick and Tasty"-it is neither quick.... nor tasty.)
So Why Aren't Mormons Considered Christians?
Simple, really. Their foundational beliefs are too different from historic Christianity and the Bible to be considered Christian e.g. the nature of God and Jesus Christ, salvation, inspired revelation ,etc. (There are plenty of web sites to explain all this, so I will leave it to you to google them if you are interested! ) Virtually all non-Mormon scholars consider the Book of Mormon, Doctrines and Covenants, etc. to be utterly untrue. Joseph Smith, who said he translated golden plates into the Book of Mormon, is rejected as a prophet by every Christian church in the world.
So whatever the Mormon Church is, it just isn't accurate to call it Christian. This doesn't have anything to do with whether it's true or not ( I obviously don't believe it is, but that's not the point.)
And so, it looks like Mitt in in trouble already. The media is already pointing out his, well, truthstretching. As he tries to paint his faith as Christian, the Democrats aren't going to let him get away with it (just search his name on youtube for an interview on CNN, or MSNBC-one of those)
And so, it looks like my prophecy of a few months ago will not come true.
Apparantly, like Joseph Smith, I am not a prophet either!!
posted by Rob | 11:18 AM
13 Comments:
Actually, the video clip I saw on youtube was from Good Morning America and can be seen at http://youtube.com/watch?v=-nnSe238oUM
Rob
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Interesting, but irrelevant. Mormons definitely do not understand what the evangelical means by the word 'Christian'. Mormons have their own connotative stand on the word, based on their unique view of history.
However, is Mitt's Mormon belief a relevant consideration for voters? Mitt Romney seems like a decent capable conservative. I would much prefer him over our current president, who is considered to be a Christian by many evangelicals.
Mitt Romney's governorship seemed straight forward, honest, and appropriate. George Bush's governorship of scoundrel politics continues in the White House. I consider his first counselor, Karl Rove, to be the most unethical politician I have observed near the oval office ... that includes the Nixon gang. He is supposedly a 'Christian', too.
So, if the Mormons cannot call themselves Christian, who can?
Read "MisQuoting Jesus" by Bart D. Ehrman. The founding Greek and Latin documents of the New Testament are filled with thousands of errors, many of which are theologically substantial. Also, I suggest reading "Lost Christianities" by the same author.
So, who is to say YOUR version of Christianity, is THE standard of Christianity?
True, Mormons claim to have priesthood authority, not present in other religions, but they have never claimed to my knowledge that non-Mormons cannot call themselves Christian.
It seems to me that you could learn a lot from the N.T. story of the woman at the well. She was a Samaritan and was used to being treated like dirt: "How is it that thou, being a Jew, askest drink of me, which am a woman of Samaria? for the Jews have no dealings with the Samaritans." (John 4:9) A major part of the story was about prejudice.
It seems to me that anyone who can give the same witness as the Samaritan woman ought to be called Christian: "[I] know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of the world." (John 4:42)
So, given that the Greek and Latin copies of the New Testament are centuries removed from the originals, and since are different by order of thousands of changes (see Ehrman), by what authority to you proclaim to have the STANDARD?
There is no doubt that anyone who proclaims Jesus to be the Christ is a Christian. [John 4:46]
It is a matter of defining the terms: proclaim, Jesus, and Christ.
But what does proclaim mean? A proclamation is more than words. It is also living as a new creation in Jesus. This can only begin from confessing your sinful nature and deep need for Jesus as Lord of your life and being spiritually born.
Who is Jesus? Jesus is the Word made flesh. [See John Chapter 1] He is eternal and co-existent with God not a created being.
Who is the Christ? The one and only promised Messiah and Savior of the World. He is both the perfect Lamb of God and the High Priest.
Anyone that believes this Truth can call themselves a Christian. For Jesus, is the way, the truth, and the Life.
Dear anonymous:
I would invite your to take a deep breath, pray for objectivity and read my last post again. You did not respond to what I said at all.
Nowhere do I infur that I define anything. Rather, it is the universal understanding of Christians everywhere that the LDS church does not belong under that name. It is not me. Sometime, look up the definition of a "fact" in the dictionary. This fits that definition.
Also, you refer to Ehrman, a liberal scholar who has a very biased point of view. Have you read the dozens of scholars who disagree with him? How about "Jesus and the Eyewitnesses" by Prof Richard Baukham" or "Fabricating Jesus: How Modern Scholars Distort the Gospels" by Dr. Craig Evans.
Be fair. Think about it.
Rob
Rob,
I wonder if someone asked the same question of me, would there be enough evidence to convict me in court?
I also wonder if any of the other in the field of Presidential hopefuls would have enough to convict them of the charge of being a Christian?
Growing up in Logan Utah put me around a lot of Mormons. It wasn't until college (early 90's) that all the people I knew started saying they were Christians too. Growing up if I said I was Christian they would say "What kind?" If I asked what they were the response would be "Mormon" (not even LDS). Even though the special on PBS, or the PBS.org discussions say they have always called themselves Christians. I for one would say (based on 20 years of aking and living there), that most of my friends didn't even consider themselves Christian. That is without going into doctorinal issues.
Don't you people have any thing better to worry about besides whether Mormons are Christian or not ? That is so Christian to judge other religions.
It is unfortunate that there are so many predjudice people in the world. If the Mormons want to call themselves Christian--what difference does it make to you? There are good Mormons, Protestants, Catholics, Jews, and yes--even Muslims--in this world. I am neither Mormon nor Christian. I do know that when you say that Mormons are not Christians, the response of my very educated and very Mormon friends is just to laugh at your stupidity and closed mindedness. It doesn't change their beliefs or their conviction that the most important thing in life is to accept others and be kind. You could learn a thing or two from them. Good luck with your quest to tell others they are wrong.
For Christians (incuding Mormons), the answer on how to judge another's Chritianity was spoken by Christ himself when he gave the Sermon on the Mount (see Matthew 7:16-18) He said, essentially, by their fruits ye shall know them. We judge another's Christianity by the way he or she lives and gives, not by the name on the exterior of the building they enter on Sunday morning. You can't know another's heart -- you can only see his life and evaluate the fruits of his actions.
Dear Acton Family member:
True, but not my point. The term Christian means something-it has a definition.For Centuries it has meant a follower of Jesus of Nazerath, as described in the bible. IF you look up Christian churches in dictionaries, almanacs,etc over the last 100 years you will not see the LDS included until recently (thanks to politically correct inclusiveness) Why? Because their teachings are just too different e.g. God and Jesus are seperate Gods, God was once a man and had a body, you can become a God and people your own planet, etc.
It is not a matter of what is "in your heart" but rather what you are going to call a belief system.
Rob
Without being contentious, is there anything I can do to reassure you of my Christianity? (and presumably that of Mitt Romney’s and your LDS neighbors’ in Logan, Utah?)
Thinkers (prophets and others) in the LDS Church have always pondered spiritual things and, believing that the heavens are open, have sought divine revelation to clarify “mysteries.” These concepts do not translate well in a non-spiritual context (You mentioned two in your response: worlds without number and eternal progression) but the doctrines of the LDS Church can be comprehended even by those who are not a part of it. Some doctrines of other faiths are initially incomprehensible to LDS believers as well, among them the idea that God the Father, Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost are one being. The baptism of Jesus Christ in the River Jordan during his mortal ministry (Matthew 3:16-17) provides evidence to the contrary when God spoke from the heavens and the Holy Ghost descended like a dove. (The Council of Nicea, after great debate, decided to favor the concept of the Trinity, but that does not make the truth of that concept the final word on the subject.)
As a minister you are probably familiar with the idea of ‘sola scriptura’ – that the Bible itself is self-authenticating and that human interpretation of scripture does not have the same authority as the scriptures themselves. Most branches of Christianity may accept the Nicene doctrine of the Trinity and reject other faiths which do not, but that does not mean that other faiths are any less Christian. I suspect Christ himself would err on the side of inclusion rather than exclusion.
Ultimately Jesus Christ himself will judge how well we wore his name individually. He is the Good Shepherd who knows his sheep and He is known of them.
I’m glad that you are committed to the teachings of the Jesus Christ, but I wish you understood that you and your faith are not alone in holding those convictions. Unity was so important to the disciples, but today we seem to be easily factionalized.
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